Coz News and Barrowmaze II

Author: DHBoggs /

Yesterday, Coz reached full funding. (yay!)

This means a print run is a go!  Now the more funds we continue to draw the prittier I can make it.  With that in mind I have a stretch goal of $5800, as mentioned in my last post, for which, if we achieve it, everyone will get a PDF of an adventure by gme designer Gerals D. Seypura.

I'd also like to mention the Barrowmaze II project up on Indiegogo in case anyone isn't aware of it yet.

http://www.indiegogo.com/Barrowmaze 

I'm running Barrowmaze I with my SWA group and having a blast.  It has become one of my favorite adventures and I'm pleased as punch to see Dr. Gillespie creating a part II.  Check it out!

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96%

Author: DHBoggs / Labels:

Champions of ZED is 96% funded!  If you have been thinking of joining the Kickstarter and haven't yet, now is the time to put it over the top.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/280000504/champions-of-zed-zero-edition-dungeoneering

I have also announced a stretch goal to my backers and now here: 
If we reach $5800 every backer (except retailer special patrons) will recieve a free PDF of a combined wilderness and dungeon adventure designed by lifetime gamer and historian Dr. Gerald D. Seypura.
Gerry is one of the original members of the Schenectady Wargamers Club and helped to establish the annual Council of 5 Nations convention 1976.  He has been playing D&D since the birth of the game, but he is perhaps best known as the designer of the Crossbones(TM)  and Wild West(TM) roleplaying games published by Fantasty Games Unlimited.  Gerry is the real deal when it comes to old school game design I'm honored to be working with him on this first Champions of ZED adventure.

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The Death dealing fighting man

Author: DHBoggs / Labels: ,

One of the things that everybody in the know, including me until last week, knows about OD&D is that fighting men get 1 attack per level against opponents of 1 Hit Die or less.  This is simply a fact that we all accepted without much thought, so let’s give it some.
The rule does not appear as such in the 3lbb’s but it’s inferred from:

 “(Attack/Defense) capabilities versus normal men are simply a matter of allowing one roll as a man-type for every hit die attacks, i.e. a Troll would attack six times, once with a +3 added to the die roll.” M&T p5 

The rule here seems to specify only attacks against normal human beings.  However, we might reasonably stretch that to include all “normal” “man-types”.  In this post here http://odd74.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=monterstreasure&action=display&thread=7165&page=2
Waysoftheearth has dug through the 3lbb’s to identify exactly what falls into the ”men”,  “man-type” or “human-type” category:

Man-type:
kobolds, ½ HD
goblins, 1-1 HD
dwarves, 1 HD
orcs, 1 HD
gnomes, 1 HD
elves, 1+1 HD
hobgoblins, 1+1 HD

Men:
Berserkers 1+1 HD
Cavemen 2 HD
Dervishes 1+1 HD
Mermen 1+1 HD
Necromancer 7 HD
Wizard 8+1 HD
Lord 9+3 HD
Superhero 8+2 HD
Evil High Priest 7 HD
Patriarch 7 HD

human-type:
Medusae, 4 HD

It’s interesting to note that there are 4 1HD creatures not listed as “man-type”.

Skeletons, Zombies, Halflings, Pixies and Nixies


That could just be an oversight, although it is also possible that all or some of these were considered “supernormal” (aka “fantastic” see below), and so not subject to the rule.  I would guess the latter is true for at least pixies and nixies.

It’s also particularly interesting to look at the Bandit entry on M&T:5:
“Although Bandits are normal men, they will have leaders who are supernormal fighters, magical types or clerical types…. For every 30 bandits there will be one 4th level Fighting-Man; for every 50 Bandits there will be in addition one 5th or 6th level…”  Supernormal here and elsewhere applies to heroic level for fighting men.  The clerics and magic users detailed in the entry are of even higher level – minimum 8th for Cleric, minimum 10th for MU.

So, in a 3lbb only game any “normal” creature, regardless of HD appears to be subject to multiple attacks from supernormal creatures.

Interestingly, that should also include attacks by “supernormal” level Magic-users and Clerics.  As far as I can tell, there’s nothing to exclude them.  (Presumably, supernormal or fantastic level for clerics would be 5 and 7 for Magic users, based on when they fight as heroes on the Fighting Capability column in Monsters and Treasure).

But then there is this:

A little over a year after publishing the 3lbb’s Gygax offered some clarifications regarding combat in the Strategic Review FAQ.
“When fantastic combat is taking place there is normally only one exchange of attacks per round, and unless the rules state otherwise, a six-sided die is used to determine how many hit points damage is sustained when an attack succeeds. Weapon type is not considered, save where magical weapons are concerned. A super hero, for example, would attack eight times only if he were fighting normal men (or creatures basically that strength, i.e.,kobolds, goblins, gnomes, dwarves, and so on).”
The FAQ rule first specifies creatures engaged in “fantasy combat” are exempt from multiple attacks, and further specifies that larger creatures (bigger than man sized) are also exempt.  The rule applies to “normal” (non-fantastic) “man-sized” (non-gigantic) creatures. 
So what is “fantasy combat”?  Well, in CHANMAIL, it is combat occurring between fantasy creatures.  What is a fantasy creature?  Broadly speaking it is a magical, enchanted or otherwise “supernormal” being.  In CHAINMAIL, fantasy creatures are all the creatures found on the Fantasy Combat Table, including Wizards, Heroes and Superheroes.  Elves, orcs, men, dwarves, hobbits and so forth are not “fantasy creatures” unless they also happen to be heroes +.  When Fantasy creatures fight each other, combat is handled on the Fantasy Combat Table and each “side” gets one roll per turn.  Otherwise, when fantasy creatures fight non-fantastic creatures they attack as a number of men on the usual combat tables.  For example, trolls fight and defend as 6 men.
So revisiting the 3lbb rule in light of the Gygax FAQ statement with our CHAIMAIL knowledge, the rule can be restated as:
“When supernormal Fantasy creatures combat each other, they normally only exchange one attack each per round, and unless the rules state otherwise, a six-sided die is used to determine how many hit points damage is sustained when an attack succeeds.  Weapon type does not effect the rule excepting the effects of some magical weapons.  When Fantasy creatures attack normal, non-fantastic creatures, however, they gain one attack roll per Hit Die or per Level, provided the defenders are roughly human sized or smaller.  For example, a Troll attacking an orc would roll on the chance to hit table six times, once with a +3 added to the die roll.  Very large or giant sized creatures are exempt from these multiple attacks due to their extreme size.  ”
That’s a good rule to flesh out the 3lbb statement.  But if one wants to go by the complete rule as given in the FAQ, it is not quite complete, because a few paragraphs further down in the FAQ Gygax attempts to give a more specific rule for what constitutes fantasy combat:
“Note that [the hero] is allowed one attack for each of his combat levels as the ratio of one Orc vs. the Hero is 1:4, so this is treated as normal (non-fantastic) melee, as is any combat where the score of one side is a base 1 hit die or less.” FAQ
Sometimes, I really wish Gygax had gone to college and taken some writing classes.  His use of “ratio” and “base” suggest you are supposed to create a fraction and reduce to determine whether fantastic combat is taking place.  Upon reflection, I don’t think that’s what he actually meant.  I think he’s giving us a version of this rule:
“…creatures with less than one eight sided hit die … entitle a fighter to a fighter to attack once for each of his or her experience levels..”AD&D Players Handbook, 1978:25
The AD&D rule makes no distinction between normal and fantastic combat, and that the FAQ does is potentially important.  The FAQ rule tells us that any combat involving creatures of 1HD or less is automatically “non-fantastic”, but it doesn’t strictly exclude creatures of greater than 1 HD in the manner that the AD&D rule does.  If one were so inclined, it could be interpreted in the light of the earlier passage this way:
  “When Fantasy creatures combat each other, they normally only exchange one attack each per round, and unless the rules state otherwise, a six-sided die is used to determine how many hit points damage is sustained when an attack succeeds.  Weapon type does not effect the rule excepting the effects of some magical weapons.  However, when Fantasy creatures attack any creature of 1 HD or less or creatures otherwise considered to be normal, and non-fantastic, they gain one attack roll per Hit Die or per Level, provided the defenders are roughly human sized or smaller.  For example, a Troll attacking an orc would roll on the chance to hit table six times, once with a +3 added to the die roll.  Very large or giant sized creatures are exempt from these multiple attacks due to their extreme size.”
Something else about the FAQ rule is different.  The AD&D rule is strictly for fighters.  The FAQ rule says ”any combat”, which seems again to include “supernormal” Magic users and Clerics.  This does make a certain amount of sense, as Wizards are included on CHAINMAIL’s Fantasy Combat Table.
In the end that may be the real difference between the AD&D rule and the the OD&D rule – that “supernormal” Clerics and Magic-Users get multiple attacks too.

6 comments

Beyond This Point Be Dragons Ability Scores

Author: DHBoggs / Labels: ,

I’ve been asked if I would provide some additional info about BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS and how it relates to Dave Arneson, and as long as people are interested, I don’t mind, doing so from time to time, but can’t devote a huge amount of time to it.  However, this post is a note I had prepared a while back.

What the first print calls “ability scores” are referred to as either personality traits or character traits in BTPBD.  On page 4 of BTPBD section “Before Setting out for Fame and Fortune” they appear in the following order:

Intelligence
Cunning
Strength
Health
Appearance
Ego (or Loyalty)

Of particular interest for our purposes are these three:
               
                Health -  Health instead of Constitution is the term            
                Arneson uses in Adventures in Fantasy
                (1979:2)

                Appearance –  Appearance instead of Charisma is the
               term originally used in early Blackmoor according to
                original player Greg Svenson.
               http://shamsgrog.blogspot.com/2009/05/q-with-greg-svenson.html

                Ego (or loyalty) – In 1st print D&D, loyalty is a measure
               used for hirelings and the only surviving application of
               Ego is in the magic swords section.  Ego as a trait stands
               out in particular for its repeated use as a character trait in
               the First Fantasy Campaign (FFC80: 14, 45, 47, 59) and is
               also a key aspect of Arneson’s magic swords creation
               rules in the FFC,  just as in 1st print.  Blackmoor fans will
               also readily recognize that the opposite of Ego, the Id was
               used to represent a famouse cult and monster in the
               setting.  The use of the Ego trait in BTPBD is
               characteristically Arneson. 

Missing completely from the BTPBD is Dexterity.   The term itself rings of Gygaxian turn of phrase  along with Charisma and Constitution, so it is not too surprising that BTPBD doesn’t use them.  Since we know that “ability scores” were invented early in Blackmoor play and are basic to the game, we can be sure they were either among the 16-20 pages of notes Arneson sent Gygax (manuscript A) or explained in early discussions between the two.  It seems likely that the addition of Dexterity and the use of Charisma and Constitution wasn’t adopted until Gygax wrote manuscript C or later, rather than being a deliberate change in BTPBD.     

Nevertheless it is curious that there is no Dexterity substitute like agility, for example.  Thus either the manuscript Arneson was working from did not have “Dexterity” (a further hint he was working off the earlier Manuscript B) or he chose to remove it for unobvious reasons.

We know from Svenson and others that a primary function of the “Character Traits” in pre D&D Blackmoor, was as saving throw categories.  As such, Dexterity is a conspicuous absence, because it is Dexterity – dodging skill basically - that one would use in many combat and magic attack situations.  It is the roll one would use to see whether a character might just have jumped, twisted, ducked in the nick of time as that bit of evil came at them.  Right?

Perhaps  - and this is just a guess - a reason BTPBD doesn’t include Dexterity is that there are already 6 “Dexterity” categories in the form of specific saving throws – Death Ray, Poison, Stone, Dragon Breath, Spells. 

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BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS, Part 4: Conclusions

Author: DHBoggs / Labels: ,



DISCUSSION AND CONCLUSION:
The question remaining is; is BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS part of the Arneson Correspondence material or was it Manuscript D, his final draft?  On the face of it, there are many clear instances of the 1st print having exactly the same or similar text as that of BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS, but the 1st print is presented in the more formal, technical, and somewhat obscure verbiage used by Gygax.  Thus there is an unmistakable relationship between each, leaving only two possibilities - either Gygax had the text of BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS or something nearly identical when writing his drafts, or Arneson had an earlier draft of Gygax’s when writing BTPBD.  In other words, based on the mix of 1st print and original text, BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS could be either a revision of earlier draft material by Gygax (manuscript B), a Later Draft by Gygax (Manuscript C or the 1st print) or could have been Correspondence material from which Gygax worked to produce the 1st print.  Three clues are very strong indicators here as to which:
1)      The spell list:  BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS contains several unique spells.  Tranquilize and Blade Barrier in particular are functional spells for which there is no clear reason for Gygax to have edited them out, had he known of them.  Likewise, the 1st print contains an additional 40 some spells not found in BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS, and at least six new monsters.  There is no conceivable reason Arneson would have deliberately edited them out – had he known about them.
2)      The known correspondence material:  As has been discussed, we know the magic swords section and the castle construction sections of OD&D were prepared from material Arneson gave to Gygax.  We know this because the original material is printed in the First Fantasy Campaign, and careful comparison leaves little doubt that it must have been used by Gygax in preparing the 1st print (and presumably the supposedly very similar Manuscript C).  But, neither the magic swords or castle construction material are in BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS.  Aside from the fact that Arneson tells us the Magic swords section predates D&D, we can be sure it does by the fact that the Magic swords text refers to “curates” (not yet the more Gygaxian “Clerics”) and these “curates” had a list of spells that was shorter than the 1st print list in some instances.   The FFC tells us there were less than 5, 4th level spells. (FFC80:44)2, but the 1st print clearly has 6, 4th level spells listed.   Beyond This Point be Dragons, on the other hand, has only 4, 4th level spells.  This suggests that Arneson’s list in BTPBD was the “Curate” list referred to in the FFC, but Arneson changed Curate to Cleric in BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS to conform to Gygax’s usage.   That very strongly suggests that BTPBD is not a revision of Manuscript C, which likely had all the known Cleric spells, but a revision of an earlier Manuscript (B).
3)      There is also the Dervishes entry to consider.  The second paragraph of the dervishes entry in BTPBD is identical to the paragraph in the 1st print regarding orcs traveling with wagons – weird for orcs, but perfectly sensible for dervishes.  But it is clear that someone (Arneson) is copying this from an earlier text that is identical to that in the 1st print because he actually types “orcs” instead of dervishes in one sentence!  We can actually trace the chronology here in that Arneson gives a very early “monster manual” of sorts in the very last pages of the FFC.  We know it is early because of the complete lack of many familiar D&Disms.  The description for Orcs given in those pages includes the details of wagon trains and so forth that obviously formed the basis Gygax used when preparing the entry for the 1st print.
4)      Unique items – the 1st print of D&D has a noticeably larger page count, and there are many things that appear in the 1st print that have no corresponding section in BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS.  That in itself would be consistent with BTPBD being an early draft.  However, as has been shown above in just the tables section, there is also a very significant amount of unique and expansionary material in BTPBD.  The value of some of the unique material is certainly debatable, and might reasonably be expected to have been edited out in subsequent drafts, yet there is also a great deal of clarified, expanded and organized material such as in the price lists, and original material such as in the spells, for which it is very difficult to see any reason for lack of inclusion in the 1st print of D&D had it been available at an early date. 
5)      The Art -  as has been mentioned, BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS is fairly lavishly illustrated, containing some 11 drawings, 4 of which are full page chapter markers with gothic letter stenciling of chapter tittles, and 1 more full page with the book title in a hand drawn font.  The remaining 6, plus the familiar sample dungeon plan and elevation, can be found in various places in the text.  These drawings took some effort to draw, place and stencil.  It hardly seems likely that such effort would be put into a working draft.
Taking in to consideration the points above and all the points previously discussed, the only reasonable explanation for the presence of the many pages of materials in the 1st print that are not found in BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS, is that the draft Arneson was working from did not include such material.  Historically, this could only mean Manuscript B.  Likewise, the only reasonable explanation of why there are unique spells,  artwork, rule clarifications, and other items in BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS, and not in the 1st print. Is that Gygax did not have them when the 1st print was made.
The sequence is thus:
Arneson – Manuscript A
I
Gygax – Manuscript B
/                      I
/          Arneson – Correspondence
      /                                         \
  Arneson Manuscript D                Gygax – 1st printed D&D (from Manuscript C)

Given all the facts thus far, by far the most likely conclusion is that Dave Arneson began to prepare BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS based on Gygax Manuscript B.  Gygax, meanwhile, expanded Manuscript B to around 90 pages (manuscript C) by adding naval and aerial combat,  about 40 new spells, new monsters, additional magic items, and the correspondence notes from Arneson regarding castle construction and magic swords. 
Thus the two men, were separately expanding “Manuscript B”.  Gygax printed his expansion, read by millions and Arneson’s, forgotten and perhaps unfinished, nearly ended up in a Minnesota land fill.









Citations

(1) Anonymous (staff)
1979    An Interview with Dave Arneson.  In The Space Gamer #21 (January/February) 1979:5-7.       Metagaming Concepts.


(2)  Arneson, Dave
1977    The First Fantasy Campaign. Judges Guild.

(3) Arneson, Dave
1979    My Life and Roleplaying 3. In Different Worlds 3 (June/July)  1979:6-10. Chaosium, Inc.

(4) Arneson, David
1999    Review of Reliving the Civil War: A Reenactor's Handbook. In Civil War Book Reviews [Website].          Louisiana State University.  Retrieved from           http://www.cwbr.com/index.php?q=2083&field=ID&browse=yes&record=full&searching=yes&S           ubmit=Search 

(5) Arneson, David
2008    Reply to Topic: Was Arneson's Blackmoor Classless? In OD&D Discussion [Website].        Retrieved from             http://odd74.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=blackmoor&action=display&thread=697

(6) Arneson, David L. and Richard Snider
1979    Adventures in Fantasy. Excalibre Games, Inc.

(7) Bub, Andrew
2002    Dave Arneson Interview. GameSpy [Website]. Retrieved from             http://archive.gamespy.com/articles/august02/gencon/arneson/

(8) De Bie, Tanja
1998    Gary Gygax: The Man in Legend.  The RPG Consortium [Website]. Retrieved from             http://www.rpgconsortium.com/articles/article.cfm?id=320

(9) Gyax, Gary
1975    WHAT’S GOING ON HERE?. In The Strategic Review, Vol 1, No. 3, 1975. TSR Inc.

(10) Gygax, Gary
1975    Letter to the Editor. In Alarums & Excursions #2, July.

(11) Gygax, Gary
1977    Origins of the Game. In Dragon 7:7-8, June 1977. TSR Inc.       

(12) Gyax, Gary
1979    Advanced Dungeons and Dragons Dungeon Masters Guide. TSR Inc.

(13) Gygax, Gary
1987    Role-Playing Mastery.  Perigee Book. published by The Putnam Publishing Group.

(14) Gygax, Gary
2002    Q&A with Gary Gygax. Enworld [website]. Posts #131,  5th September 2002, 11:23 AM.         Retrieved from http://www.enworld.org/forum/archive-threads/22566-q-gary-gygax-part-i- 9.html

(15) Gygax, Gary and Dave Arneson
1974    Dungeons and Dragons: Volume I Men and Magic. TSR Inc.

(16) Gygax, Gary and Dave Arneson
1974    Dungeons and Dragons: Volume lI Monsters and Treasure. TSR Inc.

(17) Gygax, Gary and Dave Arneson
1974    Dungeons and Dragons: Volume III Underworld and Wilderness Adventure. TSR Inc.


(18) Kuntz, Robert.
2009    Castle El Raja Key, Small Partial of the Introductory, Historical Essay. (2009, December 14).  Lord of       the Green Dragons [Weblog]. Retrieved from        http://lordofthegreendragons.blogspot.com/2009/12/castle-el-raja-key-small-partial-of.html

(19) Kushner, David
2008    Dungeon Master: The Life and Legacy of Gary Gygax. In Wired Magazine(2008, March 10).   Retrieved from             http://www.wired.com/gaming/virtualworlds/news/2008/03/ff_gygax?currentPage=all

(20) Lynch, Scott
2001    Interview with Gary Gygax, part 1 of 3. (2001, May 1) RPGnet  [Website]. Retrieved from            http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/columns/lynch01may01.html


(21) Mornard, Michael
2012    How to Address this Slight. ODD74 [webforum].  Retrieved from             http://odd74.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=6812&page=2

(22)  Private Correspondence quoted with permission.

(23)  Sacco, Ciro Alessandro.
2002    The Ultimate Interview with Gary Gygax. (reposted 2005, August 11) The Kyngdoms [Website].   Retrieved from http://www.thekyngdoms.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=37

(24) Sloan, Sam
2008    Interview with "Dungeons & Dragons" co-creator Dave Arneson (2008, March 8) Slice of SciFi      #151[Podcast].  Retrieved from http://www.sliceofscifi.com/2008/03/08/slice-of-scifi-151/

(25) Wiemholt, Michael
2001    Weem Interviews Gary Gygax (2001) Part 1 of 2. (reposted 2010, August 23).  The Weem        [Website]. Retrieved from http://www.theweem.com/2010/08/23/weem-interviews-gary-          gygax-2001-part-1-of-2/

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BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS: Looking Closer, Part 3

Author: DHBoggs / Labels: ,

QUESTION 2: ESTABLISHING DATING


To narrow down the date we will need to look more closely at what is, and is not in the text.

The organization of BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS is entirely different from the 1st print of D&D.   Remarkably, BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS is unquestionably better organized than the 1st print 3LBBs.  Each topic has a separate chapter; all tables are in one section at the very beginning of the manuscript, all terms in another, all playing rules in another and so forth, easy to find and reference, unlike the 1st print which is well known for having a convoluted layout.  For our purposes, we only need look at the first section, the Tables, to establish the likely date of BTPBD.
Role Playing Games can be compared to a song with ever changing lyric set to a constant melody of tables and charts.  As mentioned, BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS begins with a list of all tables used for the game.  As the heart of the rules, it will be useful to look through each of the tables in BTPBD and identify any differences from the first print D&D:
TABLE 1: THE OPPOSING FORCES

Content identical to 1st print but ordered differently and phrased as OPPOSING FORCES instead of Alignments
TABLE 2: TYPES OF ADVENTURERS

Fighter – identical except myrmidon consistently spelled myrmiden.  EXP required less per level
MU – conjuror and seer reversed.  EXP less by half
Cleric – EXP much less, Acolyte consistently spelled Acelyte.
TABLE 3: BONUSES AND PENALTIES TO ADVANCEMENT

Prime requisite – Experience table – similar to printed work except the percentage is different in one case - 25% instead of 20%.  Significantly, these percentages have reversed "polarity" from the first print - meaning BTPBD gives - 5% where first print gives +5%.  Clues in other parts - the dwarf entry in particular, make it clear that the adjustment in BTPBD is made to the total XP needed per level, not to the amount a player has earned in an adventure. 
Health – Hit dice – Expanded in BTPBD as a table.  In printed work, the constitution bonus to Hit dice is only a +1 or -1 and not present as a table, only as a line of text.
TABLE 4: STATISTICS REGARDING TYPES/CLASSES
Dice for Fighting Spells & Levels 

MU – Spells only to level 5; level 4 and 5 spell progression different. HD tops out at 3+1; FC much less – tops out at 4 men.

FM – Identical except FC tops out at 6 men.

C – Spells, less for curate and Lama; HD tops out at 3; FC at 3.

TABLE 5: SPELL LISTS

Clerics
LVL1) BTPBD has Remove Curses here 
LVL2) Protection From Evil listed here.  New Spell – Tranquilize, No Speak with Animals
LVL 3) New Spell – Curse
LVL 4)  Dispell Majic found here, No Speak with Plants or Turn Sticks to Snakes
LVL 5) No Insect Plague or Quest

Magic User
            MU spells end at level 5.  No level 6 spells. 
LVL1) No sleep spell, Read languages or magic is one spell;
LVL2) No knock spell
LVL 3) No Protection from Normal Missles, Water Breathing, Infravision or Slow
LVL 4)  New Spell – Redirect Edged Weapons, No Dimension Door, Growth of Plants,
Hallucinatory Terrain, Massmorph, Wizard Eye or Remove Curse
LVL 5) New Spell – Glittering Eye; No Telekinesis, Cloudkill, Feeblemind, or Pass Wall; 1st print
         6th  level spell Move Earth listed here instead.



TABLE 6: BASIC EQUIPMENT COSTS

A few minor difference in labels like Ritidar instead of Heavy Horse.  BTPBD is far better organized; 1st print simply lists ITEMs, BTPBD divides into categories of Weapons, Transportation, Armor and Other Equipment and Mounts and Trappings.  1st print has a few more items (silver arrows, wooden cross, wolvesbane, garlic buds etc.), but BTPBD has prices for additional mounts and tack for Pegasus, hippogriff, roc, griffon, and small and large thoat.

TABLE 7: ENCUMBERANCE

            Almost identical except BTPBD values are less by as much as ½ those of 1st print.

TABLE 8: WEIGHTS AND EQUIVALENTS

Small differences in text but most values are again less.  Backpack (no large or small) holds 250, wand is only 25, staff 40.  These values seem much more reasonable than the 100 and 300 of 1st print.

TABLE 9: SUPPORT AND UPKEEP OF NON-REAL PLAYERS

Some minor price differences (lesser values) from 1st print.  BTPBD has Hobbit instead of Orc.  Unique to BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS is a list of prices for hiring higher level persons such as warrior, Hero, etc., as well as what percentage of treasure they will demand as their share.  

TABLE 10: ANIMAL LOADS
           
            Unique to BTPBD

TABLE 11: MONSTER DETERMINATION & LEVEL MATRIX – UNDERWORLD

            Minor differences in column 5 and 6.

TABLE 12: SPECIFIC MONSTER – UNDERWORLD

Some differences in Monsters.  1st print table is set up for use with d10, BTPBD for use with d6.  Arnesons’ Giant Crabs, Giant Toads and Giant ferrets show up in BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS list.  Some monsters – Ochre Jelly, Black Pudding  - show up in this list but no where else in the manuscript.

1st print seems to be a reordering of this list, with some of the unexplained monsters left off the 1st print list but put into a note at the bottom saying “Other monsters to consider, depending upon the level and the surroundings…”

TABLE 13: MONSTERS - HOSTILE AND BENIGN

Very similar to pages 3-4 of Monsters and Treasure14.  A few of the treasure types listed are different in BTPBD and the order of the list is somewhat rearranged.  Also, the monsters listed from Elementals to Mule on page 4 of the 1st print, are nowhere found in the BTPBD list.  In fact, the following monsters are nowhere mentioned in BTPBD: Grey Ooze, Green Slime, Yellow Mold, Gelatenous Cube, Cyclops, and Mule.

TABLE 14: MONSTER ATTACK – “CHOPS" BY PLAYER

One immediately noticeable and Unique difference between the standard D&D attack matrix and the matrix in BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS is the use of percentages instead of the familiar d20 target numbers.  Arneson is well known for his use of percentile dice in later gaming including his 1978 Adventures in Fantasy, which is entirely percentile based.

Several more differences from the 1st print may be noted here.  First the table is only detailed for fighters, but presumably all players use the same to hit matrix regardless of character class.  Second, a separate “to hit” chance is given for each level.  In the printed work, several levels are conflated (1-3, 3-6 etc.).  The percentile chances do not precisely match when converted to d20.  1st print level 1-3 matches BTPBD LVL 3, but 1st print 4-6, then matches BTPBD LVL 4, 1st print 7-9 matches BTPBD level 7.  This pattern would seem to be deliberate but it is hard to tell.  If so, presumably the more granular percentile table in BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS came first and the 1st print levels were copied from it and collapsed.   A more granular combat table presented by Gary Gygax, in Liaisons Dangereuses #73, August 16, 1976, is a much closer match except that he still combines LVL 1-2 (matches BTPBD level 2) and levels 7-8 for unknown reasons (matches level 7 BTPBD) making level 9 mismatched between the two.  

TABLE 15: MONSTER ATTACK - "CHOPS" BY MONSTER

           
The Hit Dice range is almost the same up to 4 except that 1+1 in the 1st print is simply given as 2 in BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS.  At 4 BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS is again more granular going up by whole numbers until a column marked 9+ whereas the 1st print combines dice as 3-4, 4-6 etc.  The percentiles however do not match the 1st print d20.  The 1st print charts give monsters a 10% chance better to hit up to 4 HD and thereafter, because the columns are less granular, the chance for monsters to hit actually becomes 5% worse at level 9.  Thus the relationship between the numbers of the Monster Attacks table between the 1st print and BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS table is less clear than the “Player Attacks” table, but it may be best explained by the 1st print table being reworked with collapsed HD columns and new numbers to hit numbers to account for more granularity with monsters above 9 HD.


TABLE 16: SAVING THROWS
           
            BTPBD uses 3d6.  Unique to BTPBD, Death Ray and Poison are separate categories, thus making 6 save categories.  The categories also have two differences in names.  These are; Spells (not Spells and Staves) and Stone (not paralyzation).  Many, but not all, of the numbers are the same.

TABLE 17: CLERICS VS. THE UNDEAD
           
            Identical (patriarchs automatically turn vampires, as in 1st print “error”)

TABLE 18: CHANCE FOR AND TYPE OF ENCOUNTER - UPPER WORLD

            Lost and chance of encounter (adventure) tables identical to 1st print.  Encounter type table set for        d6, 1st print is expanded to d8, adding the categories of Men and Animals.

TABLE 19: SPECIFIC ENCOUNTER - UPPER WORLD

            1st print is expanded to d8, adding the categories of Men and Animals.  These Categories are listed as separate tables in BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS.  There are some differences in    the monster listings.  The 1st print contains a few more monsters.
           
TABLE 20: EVADING MONSTERS – UPPERWORLD

            Very similar to 1st print but some percentages are less in BTPBD.

           
TABLE 21:MOVEMENT-UPPER WORLD

            Identical to 1st print except 1st print adds boats, brooms, etc. to the list.

TABLE 22: CASTLE INHABITANTS

            Last column slightly different in 1st print.  BTPBD uses d6 such that column 1 (roll of 1or 2) and 3             (roll of 4 or 5) are more likely to come up.


TABLE 23: CONSTRUCTION COSTS - UPPER WORLD(SPECIAL AGENTS, EQUIPMENT)
(See diagram of castle design: UPPER WORLD)

            No such diagram is present in my copy of BEYOND THIS POINT BE DRAGONS.  List is identical to          .  BTPBD then gives rates for skilled retainers listed as a separate “specialist list”
           
            Included in the costs list are costs for certain individuals.  The list contains the same indivduals as
            the "Specialist" list in U&WA page 22.  Unique, however, to BTPBD, are the following:
           Adminstrator, Slave Trainer, Hunter, Female Slave, Male Slave – while these do not appear in
           the 3Lbb's, EACH OF THESE UNIQUE BTPBD NPC's ARE SHOWN ON THE PERSONELL LIST
          ON PAGE 5 OF DAVE ARNESON'S FIRST FANTASY CAMPAIGN, as are all the usual 3lbb  
          specialis..  Also present in the BTPBD are Flying Animal Rider and Flying Animal Trainer, which are
          represented by the Tarn Trainer and Eagle Rider in the FFC list.  Since these elements appear in 
          only the FFC and BTPBD it is further proof that Dave Arneson must have been the author of BTPBD

 
TABLE24: CASTLE INHABITANTS – FURTHER RETAINERS & CHANCE FOR MAGIC
            BTPBD table expanded from 1st print in MU and Cleric catergories MU has Potion and Staff     
            added and Cleric has Potion instead of Staff and has an Other category.  Percentages are also            different.

TABLE25: PRIZE MATRIX

            Numerous differences from the 1st print Treasure Tables in values and percentages, but identical in overall structure.  Type A is especially interesting having a separate prisoners column.

TABLE26: SPECIAL ITEM DETERMINATION

            This is actually two tables, which are essentially the same as the Maps Table I and Magic Items table in the 1st print.  What is different is that a d6 determines which table (1 = Maps table)  to use instead of the % Magic/Maps table of the 1st print.  

TABLE27: SPECIFIC ITEM

These tables are generally similar to the various tables found in the 1st print - there is an Armor Table, a Miscellaneous Weapons Table, a Swords Table and so forth.  There are numerous small differences, but most items are similar or identical to those in 1st print tables found in Monsters and Treasures.  HoweverThe BTPBD has it's quirksshow the characteristic informal prose and some rules deletions.  For example, in the Magic Scrolls section, "dimension" is used instead of  "planet", "trick players" instead of "dupe" and "6th level" is added to the type of monster summoned.

TABLE 28: JOUSTING

 
            Unique to BTPBD, however jousting is referenced in 1st print and the BTPBD text is clearly copied          from CHAINMAIL.

TABLE 29: DRAGONS

            The table is identical to that found in the dragon description in the 1st print, except that BTPBD
        has neither the “Range and Shape” or the “Talking/Sleeping” column.
           
TABLE30: MISSLE FIRE

            Unique to BTPBD.  A 2d6 table is given for Short Bow, Light Crossbow, Longbow, Composite 
            Bow, and Heavy Crossbow against the standard Armor Clases.  (The basic table is that of CHAINMAIL, however) A separate target number is
            given for short medium and long range for hits and a second, higher target number for each    
            range indicates an instant kill. 

TABLE31: "INSTANT KILLS”

            Unique to BTPBD – the rule given in the combat section is that a roll of two dice should take place         after any hit is indicated in melee combat, to see if the hit could be an instant kill.  The instant kill  
        table is exactly identical to the Man to Man table given in CHAINMAIL, except that the armor           types of the CHAINMAIL table are replaced with the familiar Armor Classes of D&D and horse           armor, of course, is not included.

Citations

(1) Anonymous (staff)
1979    An Interview with Dave Arneson.  In The Space Gamer #21 (January/February) 1979:5-7.       Metagaming Concepts.

(2)  Arneson, Dave
1977    The First Fantasy Campaign. Judges Guild.

(3) Arneson, Dave
1979    My Life and Roleplaying 3. In Different Worlds 3 (June/July)  1979:6-10. Chaosium, Inc.

(4) Arneson, David
1999    Review of Reliving the Civil War: A Reenactor's Handbook. In Civil War Book Reviews
              [Website].  Louisiana State University.  Retrieved from           http://www.cwbr.com/index.phpq=2083&field=ID&browse=yes&record=full&searching=yes&S           ubmit=Search 

(5) Arneson, David
2008    Reply to Topic: Was Arneson's Blackmoor Classless? In OD&D Discussion [Website].        Retrieved

(6) Arneson, David L. and Richard Snider
1979    Adventures in Fantasy. Excalibre Games, Inc.

(7) Bub, Andrew
2002    Dave Arneson Interview. GameSpy [Website]. Retrieved from 
            http://archive.gamespy.com/articles/august02/gencon/arneson/

(8) De Bie, Tanja
1998    Gary Gygax: The Man in Legend.  The RPG Consortium [Website]. Retrieved from 

(9) Gyax, Gary
1975    WHAT’S GOING ON HERE?. In The Strategic Review, Vol 1, No. 3, 1975. TSR Inc.

(10) Gygax, Gary
1975    Letter to the Editor. In Alarums & Excursions #2, July.

(11) Gygax, Gary
1977    Origins of the Game. In Dragon 7:7-8, June 1977. TSR Inc.       

(12) Gyax, Gary
1979    Advanced Dungeons and Dragons Dungeon Masters Guide. TSR Inc.

(13) Gygax, Gary
1987    Role-Playing Mastery.  Perigee Book. published by The Putnam Publishing Group.

(14) Gygax, Gary
2002    Q&A with Gary Gygax. Enworld [website]. Posts #131,  5th September 2002, 11:23 AM.         Retrieved from http://www.enworld.org/forum/archive-threads/22566-q-gary-gygax-part-i- 9.html

(15) Gygax, Gary and Dave Arneson
1974    Dungeons and Dragons: Volume I Men and Magic. TSR Inc.

(16) Gygax, Gary and Dave Arneson
1974    Dungeons and Dragons: Volume lI Monsters and Treasure. TSR Inc.

(17) Gygax, Gary and Dave Arneson
1974    Dungeons and Dragons: Volume III Underworld and Wilderness Adventure. TSR Inc.


(18) Kuntz, Robert.
2009    Castle El Raja Key, Small Partial of the Introductory, Historical Essay. (2009, December 14). 
             Lord of the Green Dragons [Weblog]. Retrieved from        http://lordofthegreendragons.blogspot.com/2009/12/castle-el-raja-key-small-partial-of.html

(19) Kushner, David
2008    Dungeon Master: The Life and Legacy of Gary Gygax. In Wired Magazine(2008, March 10).  
             Retrieved from   
http://www.wired.com/gaming/virtualworlds/news/2008/03/ff_gygax?currentPage=all

(20) Lynch, Scott
2001    Interview with Gary Gygax, part 1 of 3. (2001, May 1) RPGnet  [Website]. Retrieved 
             from  http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/columns/lynch01may01.html


(21) Mornard, Michael
2012    How to Address this Slight. ODD74 [webforum].  Retrieved from            
           http://odd74.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=6812&page=2

(22)  Private Correspondence quoted with permission.

(23)  Sacco, Ciro Alessandro.
2002    The Ultimate Interview with Gary Gygax. (reposted 2005, August 11) The Kyngdoms
             [Website].   Retrieved from http://www.thekyngdoms.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=37

(24) Sloan, Sam
2008    Interview with "Dungeons & Dragons" co-creator Dave Arneson (2008, March 8) Slice of SciFi     
            #151[Podcast].  Retrieved from http://www.sliceofscifi.com/2008/03/08/slice-of-scifi-151/

(25) Wiemholt, Michael
2001    Weem Interviews Gary Gygax (2001) Part 1 of 2. (reposted 2010, August 23).  The Weem       
             [Website]. Retrieved from http://www.theweem.com/2010/08/23/weem-interviews-gary-          gygax-2001-part-1-of-2/

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